View Full Version : .410 Buck and Ball question... Show ThaDave 08-04-2015, 09:06 PM So I recently got my New Haven 238 TB shotgun back from my brother and all is good. My GF (I actually found one that loves reloading, shooting, camping, fishing and wants to go hunting with me) and I decided that instead of a .22 or centerfire rifle, which can carry quite a distance that this little .410 would make a great camp gun. My only worry is about shooting at a yote or bobcat with birdshot may not be effective or humane and 000 buck shot and slugs around here are about $7 per 5 shells. Would it be possible and safe to use a .357 dia slug (158 grain CLSWC) with (25) #6 pieces of lead game shot (same payload weight as the factory 1/2oz loads) over the factory powder load or reloaded to equivalent. I posted this thread on another forum and got a couple good answers but was suggested that I come ask here too where I am also a member, I don't know why I didn't think to ask here first since I'll be using Cast Lead SWC.... Many thanks to -Cpileri Rustyleee 08-04-2015, 09:33 PM I have a .410 by the back door as a garden gun. I've shot a few coons and some tree rats with it but kind of felt it was lacking. I did step up to a 28 ga which seems to have about double the punch. I just didn't want to wound something. YMMV. Hogtamer 08-04-2015, 10:13 PM I 'd use one or the other - shot or slug. 20 yds from the tent #4 shot would deter or kill the size animal you mentioned. Combining the 2 will most likely be unsatifactory as it's a race to get out of the barrel, much different from a single bullet. Federal makes an awesome 000 buck load in 2 1/2 or 3" with 4 or 5 pellets respectively. The 15 pack is about a buck a throw. ThaDave 08-04-2015, 10:18 PM I 'd use one or the other - shot or slug. 20 yds from the tent #4 shot would deter or kill the size animal you mentioned. Combining the 2 will most likely be unsatifactory as it's a race to get out of the barrel, much different from a single bullet. Federal makes an awesome 000 buck load in 2 1/2 or 3" with 4 or 5 pellets respectively. The 15 pack is about a buck a throw. Would they try to race each other while still inside the shot cup? ThaDave 08-04-2015, 10:21 PM I have a .410 by the back door as a garden gun. I've shot a few coons and some tree rats with it but kind of felt it was lacking. I did step up to a 28 ga which seems to have about double the punch. I just didn't want to wound something. YMMV. Id love a 28 or even a cheap 20 but I am kinda short in the cash department and the .410 that I have I got in trade for 3 AR mags.... :-) I'm really looking to press this into use until I can get something better. beemer 08-04-2015, 10:28 PM If you reload for the 410 you have a lot of options. I have loaded 395 RB's without a shot cup with usable accuracy to 20 yds. or so. A smaller ball will work inside a shot cup. Having the RB's I didn't try a bullet but my guess is it would be a short range and inconsistent affair. A 357 bullet is to big to go in a shot cup and to small to fit the bore. If you don't reload your best bet is to buy a couple of boxes of premium buck shot and only use as needed. Dave ThaDave 08-04-2015, 10:40 PM The .357 slugs fit perfectly inside the shot cups. I don't have much else other than trying wax/shot slugs or cut shells. Hogtamer 08-04-2015, 10:48 PM There is a setback at ignition and some deformation of the underlying pellets as the crush section of the wad gives. Some gas will escape up the side of the wad. A slo-mo pic of the moment the load begins to exit the barrel looks out of control, it can't all get out at the same time and as pellets are not solid like a bullet get pushed this way and that. As mentioned the .357 is too big for the shot cup and undersize the bore so will be ocillating badly, and the lighter shot will be trying to get by. A shot column is barely controlled chaos. beemer 08-04-2015, 11:06 PM The shot cups I have are to thick for a 357 bullet, different brands do vary. I broke down a few 12 ga. shells with #2 shot and put them in a 410, might be alright for short work. The 410 has been a lot of fun to play with, I have found it very useful for pesky critters. It can also be a pain in the rear to get a proper crimp. Dave cpileri 08-04-2015, 11:20 PM Dear ThaDan, 410 principles: "Since the 410-bore doesn't normally have hardly any "crush" in its wad set-up with most loads you can use a very simple wad-column consisting of just hard nitro cards stacked between the powder and the base of the slug. If you load without any wad column at all and leave all that extra air space that the plastic shell lead shot loads that you "borrowed" the load data from don't have then it will change the dynamics of the load and the load data won't be right and you will have to futz with it and adjust the charge to get it to work right (which can be done of course) but using some kind of a wadding column or filler to take up the space such that everything is compressed and held tight and there isn't any extra powder space in the resulting cartridge makes loading by weight with "donor" load data from lead shot loads applicable with a minimal amount of adjustment." Other info: Also, according to this site: No! .395 balls are too tight Try .375 ball, loaded over 12 gr. of 2400, and enough card wads for wad column height.....roll crimp....and try...you are at your own risk for trying any unpublished load, or exceeding this level of powder....every gun can be different, but this one has worked in many styles of 410s that I own.....write me back D. Scott. Slugging your bore for best fit: 12ga but still, Here is a great pic of which size wad to use w your round ball. need to slug your bore first. “universal” 1/2oz load:
http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?257193-quot-universal-quot-shotgun-loads-410-20ga-and (http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?257193-quot-universal-quot-shotgun-loads-410-20ga-and) "13 grains is the universal load for 2400 powder in the 410-bore ~ Any hull Like all universal loading formulas some load combinations will be a slightly reduced load since the universal charge is calculated on the basis of the combination of components which will give the highest pressure level." Further reading: There are a few others I know I forgot. Basic principles of swapping slugs for shot (not vice versa): a MOST entertaining thread: http://shotgunworld.com/bbs/viewtopic.php?t=227551&p=1901294 (http://shotgunworld.com/bbs/viewtopic.php?t=227551&p=1901294) there are a few important "ifs" to substitution. Hope this all helps! ThaDave 08-05-2015, 03:22 PM There is a setback at ignition and some deformation of the underlying pellets as the crush section of the wad gives. Some gas will escape up the side of the wad. A slo-mo pic of the moment the load begins to exit the barrel looks out of control, it can't all get out at the same time and as pellets are not solid like a bullet get pushed this way and that. As mentioned the .357 is too big for the shot cup and undersize the bore so will be ocillating badly, and the lighter shot will be trying to get by. A shot column is barely controlled chaos. I see what you are saying about the set back and the smaller shot trying to get past the slug, but my question is what the actual effect of this would be in terms of safety and short range effectiveness. I am also still having a hard time understanding how a .357 Dia slug is over sized if 000 (.360 Dia) Buckshot is the most common size used in .410. The shot cups I have are to thick for a 357 bullet, different brands do vary. I broke down a few 12 ga. shells with #2 shot and put them in a 410, might be alright for short work. The 410 has been a lot of fun to play with, I have found it very useful for pesky critters. It can also be a pain in the rear to get a proper crimp. Dave Would something like a paper patch around the slug be a better idea than using the wad that is in the BirdShot shell? Dear ThaDan, 410 principles: "Since the 410-bore doesn't normally have hardly any "crush" in its wad set-up with most loads you can use a very simple wad-column consisting of just hard nitro cards stacked between the powder and the base of the slug. If you load without any wad column at all and leave all that extra air space that the plastic shell lead shot loads that you "borrowed" the load data from don't have then it will change the dynamics of the load and the load data won't be right and you will have to futz with it and adjust the charge to get it to work right (which can be done of course) but using some kind of a wadding column or filler to take up the space such that everything is compressed and held tight and there isn't any extra powder space in the resulting cartridge makes loading by weight with "donor" load data from lead shot loads applicable with a minimal amount of adjustment." Other info: Also, according to this site: No! .395 balls are too tight Try .375 ball, loaded over 12 gr. of 2400, and enough card wads for wad column height.....roll crimp....and try...you are at your own risk for trying any unpublished load, or exceeding this level of powder....every gun can be different, but this one has worked in many styles of 410s that I own.....write me back D. Scott. Slugging your bore for best fit: 12ga but still, Here is a great pic of which size wad to use w your round ball. need to slug your bore first. �universal� 1/2oz load: http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?257193-quot-universal-quot-shotgun-loads-410-20ga-and (http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?257193-quot-universal-quot-shotgun-loads-410-20ga-and) "13 grains is the universal load for 2400 powder in the 410-bore ~ Any hull Like all universal loading formulas some load combinations will be a slightly reduced load since the universal charge is calculated on the basis of the combination of components which will give the highest pressure level." Further reading: There are a few others I know I forgot. Basic principles of swapping slugs for shot (not vice versa): a MOST entertaining thread: http://shotgunworld.com/bbs/viewtopic.php?t=227551&p=1901294 (http://shotgunworld.com/bbs/viewtopic.php?t=227551&p=1901294) there are a few important "ifs" to substitution. Hope this all helps! Whicked awesome reply it is going to take me a while to read through all these but I got a little bit of time during my lunch break and a little at home. So i am going to try tonight to shoot a few that were made by cutting off just the crimp, dumping out the shot measuring everything figuring out as many of the unknowns as possible (the GF gets a lot of credit here) doing about 2 pages of notes and math (once again Props to the lady in my life) and adding 25 #6 BBs over the factory charge of powder then seating a 158 grain slug, pressed as tight as possible and then a small amount of Elmers glue was added to hold everything in place. The gun I will be testing them with is a New Haven 238TB bolt action and I will be firing the first several from behind limited cover (the tail gate of my pickup). I am also going to try a couple "cut shells" that are the factory shells but cut so that the payload will pull the plastic off the lower portion of the shell but above the brass and carry it with the shot towards the target kinda like a frangable slug. I will be using cardboard boxes as a target and plan on being about 15 yards from the target. cpileri 08-05-2015, 06:44 PM It isn't necessarily. It might be depending on your wad. you just have to measure everything together then push it backwards thru your bore as described: if it takes 6-10 lbs of pressure "a slip fit" to push the combined wad/slug back thru your bore, its a perfect fit. a 360rb load doesn't use a wad usually. . I am also still having a hard time understanding how a .357 Dia slug is over sized cpileri 08-05-2015, 06:54 PM as described here: put a hard card between the shot and slug to give the slug a firm base. pics of the assembly and assembled rounds, and of any test targets please! ThaDave 08-05-2015, 07:02 PM I am going take plenty of pictures tonight. I think the next load I do will have a card between the shot and the slug as well as on top of the slug. ThaDave 08-05-2015, 09:03 PM Ok so this is going to take a minute but here are the pictures for the prepping of the shells. 14599514599714599814599914600014600114600214600314 6004 First I started with Remington #6 1/2oz game loads, cut off the crimp, dumped out the shot about 150 BBs, put 25 back into the shell followed by a 158gr slug I cast from the mold pictured. Packed everything back down and added a little glue to keep anything from moving. I am going to test them tonight for both performance and accuracy. My target will be a 5" circle taped to card board with a 3/4" plywood backing. I will post pictures of the test and result when I get home. The last pic is a "cut shell" ThaDave 08-05-2015, 09:07 PM 146005 Just a bit of glue to hold everything in the shell during movement bit hopefully not during firing. cpileri 08-06-2015, 06:31 AM Looking foward to your targets. also if you can post some of the recovered wads and the hulls, often those tell a story too jcren 08-06-2015, 01:20 PM This may be dumb, but why not load a wadcutter in the cup first then top off with shot and a standard crimp? Should elliminate shot deformation and keep the "slug" from making a hole in the patern. cpileri 08-06-2015, 01:40 PM Actually that woudl make the slug blow a hole in the pattern. You want the shot under the slug, so the slug opens the crimp and comes out first. ThaDave 08-06-2015, 03:29 PM 146065146066146067146068146069146070146071 So we shot from about 10 paces (USMC 30" steps, left foot, drill foot, left foot, kill foot.... Ok enough moto) first I fired standard shells at a soda bottle and made it into a sprinkler attachment for the yard lol. Shots on target: First shot on target was a buck and ball with white glue. Followed by the same load with superglue with no noticeable difference. The cut shells were effective on target leaving long holes in the 3/4" plywood and still holding together enough to smack the berm but we were unable to recover anything from them due to the sun setting and wanted to get as much shooting as possible. Downside to the B&B shells limited spread of the BBs we are thinking maybe the card over the shot will keep the BBs from moving while traveling down the bore. Another idea was to replace the lead #6 shot with steel BBs for greater mass on target. Cut shells the biggest downsides while very effective they are fragile and can not be loaded into any kind of magazine they must be single loaded and in the dark with an injured animal near by if a follow shot it needed that not the time to fool with single loading an easily broken round. cpileri 08-06-2015, 08:24 PM Is that 2nd picture of a single round? for pattern? cpileri 08-06-2015, 08:25 PM careful w steel pellets in a non-steel rated wad; erosion and bore scoring will occur and ruin your gun for any useful slug accuracy. cpileri 08-06-2015, 08:28 PM I guess the bottom line is (after safety, of course): are you happy w the results? If you are, then bravo. If not, let us know because we love trying new things! ThaDave 08-06-2015, 09:26 PM The second picture is the first shot of Buck and Ball load while I was aiming at the bottom edge. cpileri 08-06-2015, 10:09 PM any evidence of the 357 slugs keyholing? 35remington 08-06-2015, 10:47 PM Yes.....I am wondering why you bother with an unstabilized tumbling slug when two buckshot in the same volume would be more effective. You should be considering an all buckshot load. Forget the teeny shot and the tumbling slug. ThaDave 08-06-2015, 11:53 PM any evidence of the 357 slugs keyholing? At 10 yards not with the slug only the cut shell. ThaDave 08-07-2015, 12:03 AM Yes.....I am wondering why you bother with an unstabilized tumbling slug when two buckshot in the same volume would be more effective. You should be considering an all buckshot load. Forget the teeny shot and the tumbling slug. I went with the slug instead of the buckshot because I don't have to buy anything to make the slugs I already have the molds and casting equipment if I wanted to spend more money Id look into just buying a 20ga and be done with it. The tiny bird shot are only because that's what came in the shells that Walmart carried for the lowest price. The biggest thing about this was to build a set up a camp gun that could dispatch a threat animal humanly, that is cheap enough to practice with so that everyone is able to hit at least a 5 inch circle at 10-15 yards 35remington 08-07-2015, 08:19 AM A 20 dollar roundball mould and multiple 36 buck would be more effective than what you are assembling, and you did say effectiveness was a criteria, Tumbling slugs veer widely. Small shot as you noted don't work well on larger critters. Spending a very modest sum to get what you need exactly seems better than a solution that is mostly ineffective. ThaDave 08-07-2015, 09:31 PM 146152146153 I picked these up today. The double mold is for a .36 BP pistol so I'll try all three projos and see what works the best. Jedman 08-07-2015, 10:33 PM Just found this post and find it A lot of fun :bigsmyl2:. I have played with 410's quite a bit and my favorite load is a 2 1/2" shell with 3 .395 or .400 diameter lead balls loaded on top of the regular wad with the petals cut off. I
have several 410's and they all shoot that load to a pattern of the 3 balls in a coffee cup sized group at 30 yards and they have enough penetration to go thru a treated 4x4 wood post. I would be confident that with a good shot angle and placement it would kill deer sized animals cleanly at 35 yards. ( not legal here in OH ) Have fun with your 410 and that GF. [smilie=w:Jedman Lever-man 08-07-2015, 11:04 PM I have a Bond Arms Ranger II what I load for it is 3 .360 RB in a 2 1/2" shell. They will fit without cutting the petals off. At 15 yds it will put all 3 in a 9" circle & go through 14 ga steel. Haven't tried it in a regular 410. dannyabear 08-07-2015, 11:40 PM I have a Bond Arms Ranger II what I load for it is 3 .360 RB in a 2 1/2" shell. They will fit without cutting the petals off. At 15 yds it will put all 3 in a 9" circle & go through 14 ga steel. Haven't tried it in a regular 410. I fit 4 of the .360" round balls ina Win AAHS shell with a Win wad and fold crimp for use in a Judge pistol. 35remington 08-08-2015, 03:58 PM Skip the conical bullet from your mould. Nothing like a projectile that wanders from the intended point of impact because of unstabilized asymmetrical aerodynamics. Stick to the round balls. The conical takes up excessive room in the shell as well. Cowboy_Dan 08-08-2015, 09:36 PM How about this for a buck and ball .410? Magtech or reformed .303 brass hull I haven't tried the above load yet. Main reason is I am unsure of the wad. I would cut the petals short at the top of buckshot, but the gas seal is likely way too narrow for the brass hulls. On the plus side, sizing the balls .430 makes them a tight fit and so probably would take place of crimping plastic shells. If the 2 1/2" load works well, I'll try out a 3" load using 9.3x74R brass. 35remington 08-09-2015, 04:16 PM The ball should be bore size or smaller. Hopefully this will not be shot through a choked barrel or it should be smaller yet. In other words don't be in a hurry to shoot an oversized ball down the barrel. ThaDave 08-10-2015, 01:05 AM Ok so we played around with the new molds and loaded 2 of every combo we could think of using .34 cal RB, .36 cal RB, .36 cal conical, .358 cal SWC and bird shot keeping everything as close to the original payload weight as possible (most of the time) I'll post pictures when I get them all together. We did try some flechettes made out of 12d nails cut to the correct length they were pretty much useless do to the spread however 1 went completely through 3/4" sheet of ply and was sticking out of the back side of the back of a second sheet of 3/4" ply spaced about 2.5' apart several were pointing out the back of the first, but most hit side ways and did little. All in all fun but not useful at all. The .34 cal RB had a lot more spread than the .36 cal RB and even the .36 cal conical. And while the conicals did keyhole they stayed pretty tight to the POI. There were 2 shells we loaded with a pair of .358 cal 158 gr. SWC had a lot more recoil, were much louder than the others and hit well below the point of aim, but did pattern well and went through both sheets of 3/4" plywood. Cases and primers showed no signs of pressure and both ejected cleanly from the gun with ease. Like I said I'll post pictures up soon. Cowboy_Dan 08-10-2015, 04:21 AM The ball should be bore size or smaller. Hopefully this will not be shot through a choked barrel or it should be smaller yet. In other words don't be in a hurry to shoot an oversized ball down the barrel. I suppose I should have mentioned these my proposed load is for a .45/.410. I definately see your point, though, and would not try them in any standalone .410. Also should mention shot sizes chosen from molds I have on hand in the spirit of the op. ThaDave 08-12-2015, 12:11 AM 146478146479146480146481146482146483146484146485 Ok it's going to take me a minute but here we go 34c = 34 caliber These were the best groups/patterns and the ones we decided to load more of to see if we can repeat these results. This test was two shells of each loading from about 12-15 yards I like shots 9&10, 15&16 Hogtamer 08-13-2015, 08:40 PM I don't get the birdshot.....just dump it out and use for your boolits. Ballistics in Scotland 08-14-2015, 01:09 PM For use on coyotes or bobcats, with a desire to be humane, this begs the question which you plan to hit him with. If it is the ball, how much difference are a few out of 25 No6 shot going to make? If it
is the shot, why not forget the ball and have a lot more of them? It strikes me that the best thing for the purpose intended would be to concentrate on a single ball or slug, both of which can be quite effective from a shotgun. The trouble is that most .410s are quite heavily choked, and don't allow a projectile which fits the rest of the bore closely, either due to its own diameter or use in a shot cup wad. ThaDave 08-14-2015, 02:51 PM The birdshot was mostly to retain as much of the original payload weight as possible. Now that I know a little more (still a lot to learn) we may do away with the birdshot. We tried a load with (2) .358 dia CLSWC in a 2.5" shell that recoiled hard, hit hard but hit low we are going to try it again but with a single slug as well as doing the double slug load in a 3" shell to see if we get better result 146646 This is the load that I liked the best and want to load more of for testing. The gf is the one (and she's right) to retest all of the best ones and filter them down based on repeatability, ease of loading and cost per shot. The is was 2.5" #8 bird shot shell that we cut and dumped then replaced the payload with (3) 36 caliber Cast lead round balls and a TP wad glued in place with white elmer's glue. The point of aim was the top edge of the black circle from 12-15 yards. I think this will work well for coyotes and such. BAGTIC 08-19-2015, 08:35 PM I would do away with the shot unless using an all shot load. At the short ranges designated it won't matter if a slug tumbles or not. A cast bullet will pivot around its center of gravity and with small animals it is going to thoroughly penetrate regardless of its orientation upon impact. BAGTIC 08-19-2015, 08:38 PM In a mixed projectile load the heavier projectile should always be on top. Even with mixed shot size loads, for example 7 1/2 and 5 the larger shot should always be on top for best patterms. The smaller projectiles are slowed by drag faster and the ones bringing up the rear (drafting) will quickly over run the leaders breaking up the pattern. edler7 08-19-2015, 11:15 PM Have you given any thought to using a .40 cal gas check for a shot or top wad? They might weigh enough to replace the birdshot you are using to make up the weight difference. 35remington 08-20-2015, 07:48 PM My objection to the pistol bullets is that they take up too much room and offer nothing over a .36 ball in terms of penetration in a relevant sense while at the same time lowering the odds of a strike where intended. More hits with useable penetration is better than fewer. CHeatermk3 08-21-2015, 12:12 AM Buck-and-ball was used in smoothbore muskets, generally 69 caliber, for shooting into a closely-packed line of infantry at close (50yds or less) range. Given the accuracy, or rather lack thereof, of these weapons, the BnB load was the original "spray and pray" type load. Besides theoretically increasing the number of wounding hits on infantry it was easier to get a reload in for a second effective volley to hopefully break the enemy's advance before closing to bayonet range. You will be better off with accuracy, producing effective hits unless firing into massed advancing wildlife infantry. In the waterfowling blinds this is also known as "flock shooting", which in my experience rarely produces game in the bag. But as long as it's safe and fun, that's what it's all about, eh? I agree your favorites look quite promising! Edit--your 9,10 target seems to have 9 holes in it? Did you shoot 3 rounds of 3 balls each, or am I not seeing the image clearly? ThaDave 08-22-2015, 01:23 AM Buck-and-ball was used in smoothbore muskets, generally 69 caliber, for shooting into a closely-packed line of infantry at close (50yds or less) range. Given the accuracy, or rather lack thereof, of these weapons, the BnB load was the original "spray and pray" type load. Besides theoretically increasing the number of wounding hits on infantry it was easier to get a reload in for a second effective volley to hopefully break the enemy's advance before closing to bayonet range. - The birdshot was mostly added to keep the payload weight as close to the factory specs as possible. You will be better off with accuracy, producing effective hits unless firing into massed advancing wildlife infantry. - Never know. Those fearsome ground squirrels can get pretty nasty sometimes. In the waterfowling blinds this is also known as "flock shooting", which in my experience rarely produces game in the bag. - I'm going Dove hunting for the first time in years next month I will keep this in mind. But as long as it's safe and fun, that's what it's all about, eh? I agree your favorites look quite promising! - Safe, fun cost and ballistically effective for humane kills on coyote sized threats. Edit--your 9,10 target seems to have 9 holes in it? Did you shoot 3 rounds of 3 balls each, or am I not seeing the image clearly? -I think you are seeing the glued in wad impacting the target. We found that was common with these loads. 35 Whelen 09-13-2015, 02:31 AM If you're needing this as you say for a camp gun for which you foresee shooting coyotes and
the such at 10 - 15 yards, I assure you a 3" load of #4 shot will trash a coyote or similar size animal at that range. 35W Outpost75 09-13-2015, 10:58 AM .410 All-Brass Shells In break-open shotguns, all-brass cases are easily made by fireforming from .303 British brass, which is cheap and plentiful. Charge the case with ten grains of any fast-burning pistol or shotshell powder. The powder type isn't important, almost anything you have around the shop will work. Push a cotton ball down onto the powder, fill the case up to the shoulder with Cream of Wheat, then press a Gulf wax plug into the case mouth. Fire-form the case pointing the muzzle straight up. The resulting case will be 2.25" in length. Cases should fire-form perfectly without splits on the first pop if they are mouth annealed first. Cases which have been reloaded as rifle rounds several times absolutely must be annealed first! A quickie on how to anneal rifle brass: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MVeRDAsrCfM With Magtech brass use, 15.4 grains of #2400 powder, thrown from the RCBS Little Dandy powder measure, using the rotor #19. Place a Buffalo Arms .44 vegetable fiber 1/16” card over the powder, then two Buffalo Arms .44-45 wool felt cushion wads , LIGHTLY oiling the top cushion wad only, applying TWO DROPS of 30 weight motor oil with an eye dropper, squishing the wad between the fingers a few times to work it in, then wrapping the wad in a square of TP, squeezing it again between the thumb and forefinger to wick out and absorb the excess oil. A .45 Schofield case holds half an ounce of lead shot to solder up a dip measure. For birdshot fill the case to within 1/8” of the case mouth, insert another 1/16” card and glue in place with Elmers. You can get a bit more shot in using the old fashioned card and fiber wad column, but my cylinder-bore gun throws better patterns using the Federal No. 410SC (1/2 oz. Skeet) shot cup over the card, pouring the shot into that and closing the shell by crimping (or gluing with Elmer's) a .36 cal. card inside the top of the shot cup, as shown in the photo below. If you have a Lee 7.62x54R Russian seater die, you can make a more finished-looking crimp, by inserting a blank Lyman 450 sizer top punch into the seater die plug, adjusting the seating stem to position the top card, below the die shoulder, then using a .44 cal. card to fit the all-brass shell, or .36 cal. to fit inside the Federal shotcup if using that wad. You want to hold the overshot card slightly below the case mouth, as you bump the case mouth against the die shoulder to form a nicely rounded, professional-looking crimp. If loading buckshot, insert a card firmly over the powder, as you did before. A Federal No.410SC plastic shotcup is used as the buckshot container and the fiber filler wads are not needed. The plastic shot cup MUST NOT be used in all-brass cases without an over-powder card, because its diameter is too small to seal the case interior. Omitting the card results in powder leaking past the wad, causing “bloopers.” After firmly seating a Federal No.410SC plastic wad, drop four 00 buck into the shot cup, then add one cast .390” round ball cast of SOFT lead on top of the stack. Adjust the seater so that the top ball is crimped positively into the end of the shell. Alternately you can load FOUR pellets of 000 buck in the shot cup, or the same number of .390" cast round balls in the brass shell with fiber wad column and no plastic shot cup. Four .39" cast round balls total 350 grains or 0.8 of an ounce. Each pellet at 25 yards has 150 ft.-lbs. of energy, about the same as a .380 ACP pocket pistol at the same distance. If the .390 balls fall through your gun's choke and they pattern well, the improvement in energy is dramatic! I use the same 15.4 grain charge of #2400 in my gun, but it is, admittedly a "hot" load. I suggest reducing the charge to 12 grains, using Little Dandy Rotor #15 and work up cautiously. The 1951 Ideal Handbook provides data with #2400 powder for .410 shells with conventional wad columns. It suggests thickness of the filler wad(s) should be not less than 1/2 bore diameter and not more than bore diameter. Minimum filler wad thickness in the 410 bore is 0.205 inches. A .444 Marlin sizer die with Lee No.5 shell holder can be used to resize brass cases if necessary. Prime cases with large pistol primers. The RCBS Little Dandy Rotors #19 measures the appropriate charge of Alliant #2400. Thumb over powder card into case mouth, and slide firmly onto the powder using a dowel. Similarly seat the filler wad(s), or plastic shotcup, if used. Add shot and top card or buckshot. Glue top card or crimp, if a suitable die is available. That’s all there is to it. Two all-brass .410s, one with birdshot and plastic shot sleeve, another with buckshot, at right is a .44-40 cartridge shown for size comparison. 148841 Pattern at 50 feet of four 000 buck loaded in all-brass shell and shot in 20" CYLINDER BORE .410 .44 Shot assembled in Starline 5 in 1 blank case with 5 grains Bullseye, birdshot and ball fired from CYLINDER bore .410. These are useable in either
.44 Magnum, .44-40 rifles or revolvers, .45 ACP revolvers, .45 Colt revolvers or rifles or break-open .410 shotguns. Effective survival kit load. Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.2.5 Copyright © 2022 vBulletin Solutions Inc. All rights reserved. How many BB's are in a 410 shell?410 shells are loaded with three 71 grain disks and twelve BB pellets.
How many 00 buckshots are in a 410 shell?410 rounds toinsure smooth feeding and easy ejection. A special alloy helps the pellets to resist deformation, thus assuring deeper penetration. This round has as its payload a bone crushing 6 pellets of 00 buckshot and has a velocity of 1,100 fps which yields over 800 foot/pounds of energy.
Do they make buckshot for a 410?#1 buckshot is available in 410 gauge.
How many rounds does a 410 shotgun hold?410 Handgun load topped off with 7/16 oz., or about 60 pellets, of copper plated #4 birdshot with a listed muzzle velocity of 1200 f.p.s. (a velocity that's similar to larger shot shells).
|
How many balls are in 410 buckshot?
Related Posts
Copyright © 2024 ShotOnMac Inc.
